'Why I Leave', Floral Image interview
Floral Image are Fergus Nolan, Jack Warner, Julien Beghain, Jonny Briggs and Mitch Forsyth. The Norwich based psyche-rock group have just released the highly rated tune, ‘Why I Leave’ . It’s produced by Gavin Bowers, released on his Catch 21 Records and accompanied by a charmed video.
Jung, sounds birthed beyond the influence of other bands and other lovely revelations which reveal the recording process.
Interview with Floral Image and their Producer by author and director, John Clay
How and when did Floral Image appear on Catch 21 Records' radar, Gavin?
Gavin (Producer): “I, like most people in Norwich, were starting to become aware of Floral Image on the local scene. I believe it was Julien who reached out to me and sent me a link to the band’s music. I began to chat about the band’s recordings and so I sent over some of my work for them to check out.
Straight away I could hear the potential in what the guys were doing which was a really exciting thing from a producer point of view. I loved that they had a really good idea about the sound. And what they wanted to achieve with the band.”
Julien, why reach out to Gavin in particular?
Julien (Drums) “Actually it's funny, I had no idea who Gavin was. For the record, I come from a country (Belgium) of eleven million people with three national languages. So the music market is tiny (because it is divided in two) and believe me, the industry players are HIDING from the artists. So when Gavin posted on Facebook, "hey we're a label and we just moved to Norwich, hello people", as a Belgian not used to the industry showing up in broad daylight, I jumped at the opportunity like a thirsty man in the middle of the desert who finds an oasis. I just sent a bottle back to the sea. And the reaction was immediate. At that moment we were mixing ‘Zonsonder’ (our previous single) and we were already thinking about what would happen after its release and so accepting a meeting with Gavin to see what he had to say made sense. The rest became history.”
Industry folk hiding from artists doesn't bode well for career oriented musicians, to say the very least. What was it about Gavin's approach that marked the difference in quality from your last single?
Jack (Keys/Vocals) “The drinks were free? But seriously, Gavin makes a great whiskey and coke. We created our previous three demos all in-house so in my self-critical head, there is a youthful innocence when it comes to those mixes. Gavin brought his 15+ years of experience to the band and the result (‘Why I Leave’) speaks for itself - an amazing drum sound, wonky production ideas (in the most fantastical way) and a vastly expansive sonic soundscape which even that blue hedgehog would be proud of. I think we’ve only scratched the surface of what we can achieve together too.”
What was the mission brief when approaching production?
Gavin: “From my side of things, the mission was to first hear everything the guys had, even half finished demos, live phone recordings - all of it.
Find the songs I thought I could develop, and try to get in the guys head spaces as much as possible. I wanted to make something that was organic and warm sounding but coated in electronic sounds too. Staying true to their sound but giving it a wider stage sonically to play on.
In short, evolution not revolution.”
Did the theme of the track or its lyrics impact sound design in any way?
Jack: “Going back to the mission brief, we were keen to try absolutely anything and everything that our tiny minds could summon - no barriers whatsoever. Tracking ‘Why I Leave’ was a lot of fun, with lockdown kicking in halfway through we had a rather some time to think about where we wanted to go with it.”
Gavin: “Jack’s totally right; nothing was off the table and everyone was totally onboard with that mantra which really helped us explore all the strange new worlds. Lots of fun too.”
Fergus (Guitar/Vocals): “I think the lyrics being as melancholic and reflective as they are lend themselves to the sonic layering we put into it. An attempt to lay a musical bed to where your mind could travel to in a way. I even went off the fretboard for the first time ever recording the guitar … so that’s a thing.”
Gavin: “That’s was a great session I’ll never forget Ferg’s face when I was yelling at him to go off the fretboard and he totally went there.”
Sounds like a lot of mirth gave rise to the required trust for people to take risks. I'd like to know more about those, but let's head back a little and find out what each member brought to the recording process besides playing. Tell us about 'getting into the headspace' of the members Gavin.
Gavin: “I think everyone had a massive part to play in the process and as I got to know them better and how they worked as a unit, I got to see that more. I realised early on that we had similar musical tastes.
Thing is I’m coming from an analogue background so having these guys who are great in the digital world was very good for bouncing ideas around, push the limits of what we could do with a computer yet keep that real world feel. Both Jack and Julien are completely at home on the desk and on the stage so that mixes really well with some of my more unorthodox production techniques.
The song was actually built around Jack and Ferg’s original demo and used as a guide track to work from. Reverse engineering.
Jack and Ferg also had a massive part to play in the mixing process and we worked on the final stage of mixes together trying out different ideas and always putting the track first. It was nice trying to figure out the best ways to bring their ideas to life.”
Could you be specific about the tastes you speak of without citing specific bands?
Gavin: “Well to generalise then, we’d be talking about a lot of psychedelic music, shoegaze, dream pop but naturally the guys are clearly influenced by loads of other stuff.”
Fergus: “I think it was more a group pledge to try and continue the great lineage of weird sounding pop music before us. It’s just a question of what sonic rabbits Gavin could pull from his big psychedelic hat to make the song have enough interesting things going on.”
Julien: “ I really felt that Gavin understood very quickly that the influences within the band are very diverse. He managed to channel that into something that is truly coherent.”
Sounds like a lot of harmony going around the studio. Were there specific ideas that came out of your union that surprised you? It's well known that Hendrix would try to imitate the sounds he heard as he plummeted to the ground via parachute during his brief military service. Or another example of an influence beyond another band could be in a number of sounds used on Pink Floyd’s ‘The Wall’.
Keen to know if there were any sounds that had an intriguing backstory. Those electronic sounds Gavin introduced you to for example.
Julien: “The thing that remains in my mind is Gavin's use of the sound of my hi-hat. In the verses I do groups of three sixteenth notes and before recording I suggested to Gavin to try using a crash cymbal with a hole in it as hi-hat bottom. At the beginning Gavin was not very convinced but he let me do it and then he appropriated this sound (which comes from hip hop drummers) to make something crazy out of it. If I think about my part, it's the thing I'm most proud of and it's thanks to Gavin and his ability to appropriate influences.”
Where did your initial idea come from Julien and how did it relate to the theme of the track?
Julien: “My idea was that the rhythmic pattern is repetitive (intentionally) and that the way I could create rhythmic tension would be with the hi-hat and I wanted it to sound a bit dirty, a bit sharp to emphasize the accents. And hip hop drummers use this technique to reproduce electronic hi-hat sounds.”
Jack: “Going back to the interesting sounds, which this song has a few of, just before we were finished tracking synths, I figured the song could benefit from some kind of air-raid siren, to give it tension. I found some gnarly sound on my Korg Minilogue XD and we recorded it. You can now hear it in the second half of the song. Now you say it, it is straight out of ‘The Wall’ or ‘Wish You Were Here’.”
Gavin: “I was literally just writing about that sound jack. Lol, totally makes the second verse work in the way it ramps up. Love it.”
Intriguing stuff.
Was there much talk of the song’s emotional meaning during the recording process, and were there revelations in that understanding during mixing?
Fergus: “It meant a lot to us as a band at the time. To be working on something that is as unnecessary as a quirky pop song during a global pandemic was as it turned out, completely necessary to us all. Long live art!”
Gavin: “This song meant a lot to me and gave us all something to focus on in a difficult time and what meant more was these guys trusting me to filter their ideas and vision into the great thing we have now.”
Jack: “More intimately, Gavin really added our personality and emotion to the recording process when tracking Ferg's lead vocals. We digested the lyrics together in the room and what they meant to us and it was the best I've ever heard Ferg sing. Gavin's vocal recording technique is second to none - he really got the best out of us.”
Julien: “During the mixing I realised I still have so much to learn. And especially from those guys.”
Do you recall any obstacles at any stage that were informative to your process?
Gavin: “Well covid was a massive one for us all. Obviously and there wasn’t much that could be taken away from that unfortunately. Finding the right mastering engineer was tough. We tried three different ones, and we learnt that just because something is industry standard doesn’t mean it’s the right fit for every track. Moving forward this is something that will stay with me.”
Fergus “Yes, having never been involved with anything that’s been mastered before that was an eye-opener. Lyrically I was unsure whether to be so revealing of the Jungian shadow that dictates my behaviour. That’s a long dark road if ever there was one.”
Were the lyrics written with an awareness of Jung, or is his area of study something you delved into further after the fact?
Fergus “Oh totally. The lyrics are if nothing else an ode to what he dedicated his life of work to. I’d read Jung as a Psychology student yes, however they just seemed like empty words in a worn out text book until you live through your own life and he just gets proven to be correct.”
Jack “Being someone who works in mental health and is passionate about it's awareness, I am often pestering my friends and fellow bandmates and offering therapy to them. So perhaps I've also been doing Jung proud and squeezing some feeling juices out of you Ferg … sounds weird that. On reflection maybe it's a bit of Freud too!”
Fergus “Yes that certainly sounds like a Freudian slip to me.”
There is the danger of taking his theories as gospel despite contemporary progression, right?
Fergus: ”Jung or Freud?”
Jack “As a general rule, I certainly get uncomfortable with old school theories about the ol' brain box. There are patterns, yes, however I like to think that we're all individuals who have unique experiences - let's learn from each other’s difficulties and challenges. In the words of Chris Martin, let's talk.”
Gavin: “And nothing better than an ego death in the studio to get everyone’s creative juices flowing.”
Fergus : “I don't think that the human mind has changed much since Jung was writing about psychological shadows governing behaviour. Would it sound brazen to say that the Jung doubters simply do not want him to be correct for the sake of their own concepts of who they believe themselves to be being shattered?”
I was referring to Jung, but yeah, Freud can be treated with an unquestioning subservience. Perhaps we can steer our conversation through a more specific prism of how his teachings affected you and translated into lyrics?
Fergus: “Having that peep into human behaviour is a giant well of intrigue for a songwriter. Most songs that move me are about the effects of the human condition. Maybe that Jungian approach helps you pull from yourself what can only be found in others too, that sounds like a surefire way to get to the listeners heartstrings to me John!”
Jack: “Shall we start a Jung-based band that plays Jungle songs Ferg? Band name suggestions welcome.”
Gavin: “Guys it would have to be called "Animus".”
What's more important to you collectively? A pure expression of a mood or a successful tug on the heartstrings of an audience?
Fergus: “Hmmmm, probably pure expression of a mood if I had to pick one. You can't go for the listeners heartstrings all the time, that's just audio-emotional molestation.”
…And how about the rest of you?
Jack: “On behalf of the band, I'd like to clarify that we don't intend to molest your souls, tinker with heart-strings and infest your minds. If that's the side effect of a heavy dose of Floral Image expression of one's emotions, we can only apologise. But buy our records to fill the void in my low self worth - PLEASE.”
Ha!
Gavin: “Speaking from a producer’s point of view, the listener can tell straight away when something isn’t genuine on any level. The stuff that is truly timeless gets played time and time again. Music that tugs at the heartstrings is born out of an honest feeling or life experience. That’s why people will still be playing "Why I leave" in fifty years time.”
Julien: “I have always played thinking "if I play with heart and get the result I want and therefore love, there will probably be someone else who will also love it … I am not so unique". I've always played with concerts in mind … I like to see people smiling, to feel their reactions to what we do. That's my drug. I don't violate their souls, I feed off their feelings. Like a good vampire.”
A still from the ‘Why I Leave’ video directed by Alberto Allica
Is there any particular aspect of the record you'd like to revamp if given a chance?
Gavin: “There’s always stuff I’d love to go back and track again but then it wouldn’t be this song or that moment in time we captured.
I love what we have and part of that it’s appeal are the little imperfections that bring in the human element.”
Jack: “Yeah I think us music makers and producers, will always suffer from Kevin Parker syndrome and want to change things. But more than any other song we've done so far, I am so proud of this tune and wouldn't change anything … honest.”
Fergus: “For me...Probably most of, if not all the lyrics.”
Jack: “Is everything okay Ferg? I love you and I am here for you mate. So to summarise, we are another set of insecure musicians who need applause sometimes, okay? God I miss gigs...”
Fergus: “Yeah sorry, it's just all that talk of Jung has made me want to massively back-track on everything I have ever written or said.”
Jack: “It's a good job I am a trained mental health peer support worker isn't it! Floral Image and C21 will be offering music-related therapy from 2021 onwards. Watch this space.”
Julien: “I'd change my bass drum playing and swap the ride for a quieter one. It gave Gavin some sweat during mixing.
… but lesson was learned and fixed during the recording of our next single.”
I'd love to hear from Mitch Forsyth and Jonny Briggs about their inclusion in the recording/mixing process. Anything to add fellas?
Mitch (Bass): “Jonny and I's contribution was more pre-determined than anything else I reckon. Precognitive, in a way. We actually met each other years and years ago, and meticulously plotted the careful nudging of events that would lead to ‘Why I Leave’ coming together. We were always the masterminds. It'll be an almost thirty five year gestation as of next week.”
Ha! Now that's one helluva Sci-Fi ending. Thanks for talking to me guys. It's been a blast.
Jack: “Thanks John! ‘Why I Leave’ is out now on Catch 21 Records - available to buy on our Bandcamp. or to listen on the streamies.”